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Hitting a brick wall with pronouns

 

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  #1  
Old May 31, 2010, 02:19 PM
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Hitting a brick wall with pronouns

Mi gramática no es bien. ¿Puede se ayudarme? Espero estás correcto.

Basically, my grammar stinks, and I need help. I've been studying my Spanish books for 8 months, and still don't understand the grammar.

Things like this make me confused..

¿Puede hacerme un presupuesto?

Puede means, "can you" which is easy, but is hacerme a combination of two different words? I think it's a combination of hacer and me, but I'm not sure. If it is a combination of "hacer and me" can you put it as "me hacer" too?

I think the sentence translates to, "Can you give me an estimate?

Other things I struggle with are words like "lo" "se" "le." I have a small idea of why they are used, but I think I need it explained to me.

Any help would be greatly appreciated, even if it's just a link.

Last edited by Esperar; May 31, 2010 at 04:05 PM.
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  #2  
Old May 31, 2010, 03:54 PM
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You're asking questions about pronouns, which would be a good idea for the title.

You named several different types of pronouns, but should focus on just a certain set at one time, until you feel confident that you know them.

In the example of hacerme, you're right; two words were combined - the infinitive hacer and the indirect object pronoun me. Learn what role the indirect object pronouns play, if you don't already know that. Then learn what the Spanish indirect object pronouns are.
Indirect object pronouns are suffixed to infinitives. But, when the verb is conjugated, they precede the verb. So, to answer your other question, me hacer is not correct.
The two verbs used in the sentence aid each other. The first is conjugated, but the second is not. Since the first is conjugated, it is quite alright to place the indirect object pronoun in front of it.
¿Me puede hacer un presupuesto? and
¿Puede hacerme un presupuesto? are identical questions.

The translation you gave of the sentence is correct.

There are tons of posts about the different pronouns used in Spanish here in these forums. Check them out and see if they answer your other questions. The more specific a question is, the better it can be answered.
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  #3  
Old May 31, 2010, 05:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Esperar View Post
Mi gramática no es bien. ¿Puede se ayudarme? Espero estás correcto.

Basically, my grammar stinks, and I need help. I've been studying my Spanish books for 8 months, and still don't understand the grammar.

Things like this make me confused..

¿Puede hacerme un presupuesto?

Puede means, "can you" which is easy, but is hacerme a combination of two different words? I think it's a combination of hacer and me, but I'm not sure. If it is a combination of "hacer and me" can you put it as "me hacer" too?

I think the sentence translates to, "Can you give me an estimate?

Other things I struggle with are words like "lo" "se" "le." I have a small idea of why they are used, but I think I need it explained to me.

Any help would be greatly appreciated, even if it's just a link.
Do you know your grammar? (English grammar)
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Old May 31, 2010, 05:13 PM
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I hit a total wall with the pronouns just like you did... I know you're not a fan of it, but Rosetta Stone got me through it very well. I suggest you go through these pages:

First, go over reflexives:
http://www.studyspanish.com/lessons/reflexive1.htm
http://www.studyspanish.com/lessons/reflexive2.htm

Then, look at indirect object pronouns:

http://www.studyspanish.com/lessons/iopro1.htm
http://www.studyspanish.com/lessons/iopro2.htm
http://www.studyspanish.com/lessons/iopro3.htm

Finally, check out indirects and directs used together

http://www.studyspanish.com/lessons/iodopro.htm

Those all, and Rosetta Stone, really helped me get those pronouns. Like I said in another topic, you don't have to pay the Study Spanish premium course fee or whatever it is to get the best out of their site.
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Old May 31, 2010, 06:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chileno View Post
Do you know your grammar? (English grammar)
Do you mean do I know about what terms such as "conjugations" mean, and so on? If so, no.
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Old May 31, 2010, 06:23 PM
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In addition to verb conjugations, do you understand the difference between a direct object pronoun and an indirect object pronoun in English? That is what chileno is wondering.
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Old May 31, 2010, 06:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Esperar View Post
Do you mean do I know about what terms such as "conjugations" mean, and so on? If so, no.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rusty View Post
In addition to verb conjugations, do you understand the difference between a direct object pronoun and an indirect object pronoun in English? That is what chileno is wondering.
Exactly, and everything else.

I wanted to know if before starting Spanish grammar, you were familiar with these terms in English.

So, why start doing it in Spanish instead of English?

Better yet, why start at all, grammar that is?

Don't get me wrong, grammar has its place, but since you can manage yourself in your language, without the help of your language's grammar, you can accomplish the same thing in Spanish. Later, if you feel compelled to learn grammar, do so with your own language to later level Spanish grammar.

I know, it seems impossible, but I did it. The other way around.

I had to level English to the level of my Spanish, and you have to level Spanish to the level of your level in English.
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  #8  
Old June 01, 2010, 03:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rusty View Post
In addition to verb conjugations, do you understand the difference between a direct object pronoun and an indirect object pronoun in English? That is what chileno is wondering.

This is what I will be learning today, and then I will move on to Waffle's links.

I will also not be speaking anymore Spanish on this forum until I am confident I have got it right.

Last edited by Esperar; June 01, 2010 at 04:32 AM.
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  #9  
Old June 01, 2010, 05:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Esperar View Post
I will also not be speaking anymore Spanish on this forum until I am confident I have got it right.
Don't be so hard on yourself, the pronouns will probably hound you for years to come. Especially "se", and often whether to use "lo/la" (direct pronouns) or "le" (indirect) also.

But whatever the case, get interested in learning the grammar behind the Spanish that you read or hear - that will make everything easier when you're trying to formulate your own thoughts. (In short, don't believe anything Chileno tells you )

Good luck!
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¡Muchas gracias por corregirme!
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  #10  
Old June 01, 2010, 07:05 AM
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I will still be posting on the forums, I really like it here, but I don't want to reenforce my mistakes. I am going to study even harder.
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