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Se robaron a mi abuelita

 

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  #1  
Old January 29, 2024, 09:58 AM
Tyrn Tyrn is offline
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Se robaron a mi abuelita

Hi,

Context Reverso gives they stole my granny;

Translates it back: me robaron a mi abuela;

Translates they stole from my granny: le robaron a mi abuela;

Finally, they stole it from my grandmother: se lo robaron a mi abuela.

The latter is my lasting pain: I can never decide whether this se is just le, which points to the grandma (this is the case, I guess, but how can I be sure?), or it is really se, and it belongs to the reflexive verb. With five years under the belt it's very, very frustrating...
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Old January 29, 2024, 08:07 PM
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AngelicaDeAlquezar AngelicaDeAlquezar is offline
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Direct object and indirect object.

The thing that was stolen is the DO and the person from which they stole is the IO.

-Me robaron a mi abuela.
My grandmother was stolen from me.
-Me robaron mi libro.
They stole my book.

- Le robaron a mi abuela.
We don't know what they stole, but we know it was the property of my grandmother. So in this case, we don't have a DO, but we do have two indicators of IO. In many countries, the IO is often expressed with both, the Indirect Object and its pronoun. The usage of the pronoun may be considered redundant, but not incorrect.
- Les di dulces a los niños. - I gave candy to the children.
- Nos prestaron dinero a nosotros. - We were lent money.
- Te conté a ti un secreto. - I told you a secret.


Finally, when you have both the pronoun of the IO and the pronoun of the DO in the same sentence, IO goes first, and you don't use "le lo(a)"/"les lo(a)"; you use "se" for the third person:
- Se lo robaron a mi abuela. -> It's grammatically incorrect to say "le lo robaron". You must use "se" for the IO pronoun.


- Le dijeron que viniera. -> Se lo dijeron.
They told him to come. -> They told it to him.
- Les di dulces a los niños. -> Se los di.
I gave sweetsto the children. -> I gave them to them.
- Les prestaron sus bicicletas. -> Se las prestaron.
They lend them their bicycles. -> They lend them to them.
- Le puse crema al pastel. -> Se la puse.
I put cream on the cake.-> I put it on it.
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Old January 30, 2024, 11:02 PM
Tyrn Tyrn is offline
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Thank you very much! I'm going to read and reread your answer

Again, just to make sure:

Le robaron a mi abuela: everything's indirect.

Se lo robaron a mi abuela: the abuela is still indirect, but the direct object lo is introduced, albeit in the form of a pronoun. That's why one has to change le to se, although it still points to the indirect grandma? I still can't swallow it. The grammar books I read led me to believe (they never told that in so many words, I grant it) that se lo is just a euphonic substitution for le lo, which indeed sounds ugly
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Old February 02, 2024, 09:12 PM
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AngelicaDeAlquezar AngelicaDeAlquezar is offline
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In "Le robaron a mi abuela", you are right that there isn't an explicit DO. We only know that there was some property stolen from my grandmother, because of the usage of "le". If the sentence would have been "robaron a mi abuela", only the context can tell if it was her or her property that was stolen.

And in the case of "se lo robaron", the listener already knows what the stolen object was. For example:
- Le robaron el bastón a mi abuela. Se lo robaron. -> The stolen thing was her cane.
- Me robaron a mi abuela. Me la robaron. -> My grandmother herself was stolen from me.


However, as I was going back to your original question, I found that your first example was "Se robaron a mi abuela", not "Me robaron a mi abuela".
I'm finding it hard to explain, but here it's not an OD/ID "se". It's rather a use of "se" as a way to clarify it's my grandmother who has been stolen.
You could say "Robaron a mi abuela", but if the context is not clear, the listener will think something was stolen from her. Yet, if you say "se la robaron", there is no doubt that it was the person herself and not anything belonging to her. Also, this "se" makes it clear that she was taken away against her own will.

- No encuentro mi teléfono. ¿Quién se lo llevó? -> Since it's not a question about where or to whom the phone was taken, I'm emphasizing the fact that it was taken away and I could not do anything about it.
- ¿Por qué se trajeron al niño a la fiesta? -> Here, I'm emphasizing that the kid is here because of the sheer will of the people who brought him to the party, nor mine or the child's opinion were taken into account.

Anyway, keep asking questions until you're satisfied with the answers; I know it's pretty confusing.
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