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-   -   'The' (definite article) questions (https://forums.tomisimo.org/showthread.php?t=18434)

'The' (definite article) questions


Xinfu June 24, 2014 02:26 AM

'The' (definite article) questions
 
I think THE for festivals is optional; do you agree?:

-We celebrate (the) Sun/Moon/Lantern/Bun/Boat Festival.


This FESTIVAL means a day or period of the year when people stop working to celebrate a special event, often a religious one; NOT a series of performances of music, plays, films/movies, etc, usually organized in the same place once a year.

Xinfu June 26, 2014 10:46 PM

Is THE optional?:

-If you are considering taking a boyfriend, (the) next semester/term will be the best time.

Rusty June 27, 2014 05:22 AM

Yes.

Xinfu June 28, 2014 11:02 AM

Thank you~ Is A/AN/THE optional?:

-They will do (an/the) in-depth reading (should I use the plural for READING?)of a couple of/a few research-based articles.

Rusty June 28, 2014 11:58 AM

They will do in-depth reading of a couple of research-based articles.
They will do in-depth reading of a few research-based articles.

Pluralizing 'reading' suggests that reading the articles once is not sufficient.
If you add 'an' before 'in-depth', you are clarifying that only one reading will be done.

Xinfu June 29, 2014 09:10 AM

Thank you~For

-He is currently 16th in the world rankings.

Is it optional to pronounce THE before 16th etc?

Rusty June 29, 2014 09:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xinfu (Post 150254)
Is it optional to say THE before 16th, etc.?

Yes. Adding the definite article would be adding emphasis or contrast.

Xinfu July 10, 2014 08:04 PM

Thank you~

Without referring to a particular group of girls, can I say this?:

-He is very popular with the girls.

using THE to mean all girls. Like this:

-Consider the ravens: they never sow nor reap, they have neither storehouse nor barn, and yet God feeds them.

In the Bible, this THE means all members of the kind. Do you think my theory is possible?

Rusty July 10, 2014 08:19 PM

Yes, "He is very popular with the girls," is a commonly used English sentence and it means what you said.

poli July 10, 2014 08:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xinfu (Post 150517)
Thank you~

Without referring to a particular group of girls, can I say this?:

-He is very popular with the girls.

using THE to mean all girls. Like this:

-Consider the ravens: they never sow nor reap, they have neither storehouse nor barn, and yet God feeds them.

In the Bible, this THE means all members of the kind. Do you think my theory is possible?

He is very popular with girls and He is very popular with the girls can have the same meaning. The difference is when you use the girls the meaning becomes ambiguous, because when you use the girls it may refer to a specific group of girls as opposed to girls in general.

The same can be said with the ravens.

Xinfu July 25, 2014 01:31 AM

Thank you~If a person's name is Hana Yori Mada, does my theory hold up?:

-HYM are the initials of her name. (HYM=all the initials)(THE must be used)
-YM are initials of her name. (YM=part of the initials, so THE must not be used)

Rusty July 25, 2014 04:58 AM

You can use the definite article in either sentence, but omitting it in the sentence with only a partial list of her initials does convey the idea that we don't have all of the initials.

Xinfu July 27, 2014 02:53 AM

Thank you~

eg When is (the) course selection time?/(The) course selection time this year will be on 8th August.

My theory:
If 'course selection time' is regular every year, at the exact same time, then THE must be omited, like 'I have lunch at noon', not THE lunch; if not regular, THE must be used. (After typing this, I feel strange, because in English I've heard 'This is payback time', not THE payback, etc., though it is irregular)

Do you agree?

Rusty July 27, 2014 07:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xinfu (Post 150789)
When is (the) course selection time? /(The) course selection time this year will be on 8th August.
('on August 8th' or 'on the 8th of August', in American English - it is also possible to write 'on 8 August', but we would read it 'on the 8th of August' or 'on August 8th')

My theory:
If 'course selection time' is regular every year, at the exact same time, then THE must be omitted, like 'I have lunch at noon', not THE lunch; if not regular, THE must be used. (After typing this, I feel strange, because in English I've heard 'This is payback time', not THE payback, etc., though it is irregular)

Do you agree?

It is natural English to say your sample sentences without the definite article, but the theory you have presented doesn't quite square up with why we omit it.

I think we omit the definite article when we have a sufficient "determiner," or when the event is not tied to a specific time.

If we were to remove the adjuncts (the nouns that modify the noun 'time'), we'd have to include the definite article.
When is the time of course selection?
When is the time of payback?

Because 'payback time' is a well-known collocation, the reworded sentence sounds awkward, although grammatically correct.

If we were to talk about the time specifically, we would add the definite article, as in "The course selection time you've selected is no longer offered."

Xinfu July 31, 2014 12:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rusty (Post 150794)
It is natural English to say your sample sentences without the definite article

Thank you~

1. I assume you mean THE is optional in those 'course selection' sentences?

2. Do you agree with my analysis:

-Giving handouts can even wealth distribution among poor and rich. (distribution in general, no THE)
-Giving handouts can even the wealth distribution among poor and rich.
(with the same meaning as 'the wealth distribution of poor and rich', hence THE)

So THE is optional.

poli July 31, 2014 07:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xinfu (Post 150856)
Thank you~

1. I assume you mean THE is optional in those 'course selection' sentences?

2. Do you agree with my analysis:

-Giving handouts can even wealth distribution among the poor and rich. (distribution in general, no THE)
-Giving handouts can even the wealth distribution among the poor and rich.
(with the same meaning as 'the wealth distribution of poor and rich', hence THE)

So THE is optional.

Where I put the the, the is needed, but you are right about it being optional in front of wealth.

Xinfu August 02, 2014 07:06 AM

Thank you.

1. But do you agree we can say 'between poor and rich'?

2. At a college 'Formal Hall Dinner' is held at the beginning and end of a term; what difference does THE make?:

-How many times have you been to/attended/gone to (the) Formal Hall Dinner?

Rusty August 02, 2014 07:25 AM

Yes, 'between poor and rich' can be used, but you'll hear 'between the poor and the rich' much more often.

As to the question about (the) Formal Hall Dinner, it makes no difference if 'the' is present or not. However, if 'Formal Hall Dinner' is modified, 'the' will accompany the adjective or adjectival clause.
... the last Formal Hall Dinner ...
... the Formal Hall Dinner of 2012 ...
... the spectacular Formal Hall Dinner ...

Xinfu August 04, 2014 04:03 AM

Thank you~

Do you agree with my analysis?:
-Their family has a history of cardiac arrest. So (the) descendents of the family are prone to have it. (no difference in meaning. Referring in general, no THE; referring to all descendents, with THE)
-(The) Organisers of the XYZ movement have spoken out against government intervention. (no difference in meaning. Referring in general, no THE; referring to all organisers, with THE)

Rusty August 04, 2014 10:03 PM

Agreed.


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