Abortion

[Jessica]

Originally Posted by CrOtALiTo

Jessica.

I'm sorry for tell you this.

But the life starts when the women leaves pregnant.
Always although you have only 1 pregnancy week the baby and the life has already started.

You're a wrong.

well maybe you're right but as I said before, it's the woman's choice 100% because it's her body...maybe it's better for her to have it and give it up for adoption...but she should not be forced that. If she wants the abortion, let her have it.

also, I'm not saying all pro-life people do it, but remember when that abortion doctor was killed? The person that killed him was a hypocrite. He's against a murder of a baby and he kills someone....again, not all pro-life people are like that. I'm just saying that no one has the right to decide what a woman should do with her own body :S that's all

Maybe the woman should have been more responsible...but ultimately, it's still her choice...

[poli]

De acuerdo. La educación es muy importante, pero la naturaleza tiene sus trucos y a veces los embarazos no planificados ocurren con educación o
sin educación. Admito que el aborto es extremo, pero en estes casos la mujer debe tener la opción de un aborto legal si eso es su deseo.

Una vez alguien me preguntó en un modo retórico, "¿Si fuera el trabajo del
hombre llevar el feto en un embarazo crees tú que sería la misma
batalla pro/contra?"
A lo mejor la opción del aborto sería legal por todo el mundo si el hombre tuviera que experimentar la inconveniencia del embarazo, y la criaza del
niño no deseado después.

[irmamar]

Muy bien, poli. Has dicho una gran verdad.

As a woman, I wouldn't like to live such a circumstance to decide if my own pregnancy must go on or not. But I understand that there are many circumstances which can lead a woman to abort and I like the freedom to decide. And I agree with Jessica that is the woman the only one who has the right to make that decision, neither men, nor laws or religion. A woman knows her circumstances and I am sure that it is not an easy decision to take.

Two different women I know had a pregancy with a baby with "anencefalia" (without brain or without a part of the brain). One of them lived her pregnancy when abort wasn't allowed in Spain. Doctors didn't tell her the case, but her husband (and he didn't tell her either). Everybody (her parents and husband) knew that the boy was going to be born dead, or he could live for some hours. But she, in her ignorance prepared herself for the birth and bought clothes and other things for the baby. As nature is so wise, it didn't allowed the baby to be born, since if he were born he would die. At last, the birth was induced, because if it wasn't, the child would have kill her mother. He was born dead, so he wasn't considered a person, so he couldn't be even buried with their family (I've never asked where he was buried). But her mother had the greatest grief in her life, all her illusions, her first baby, was not only dead, but he could kill her. Her family had to hide the truth and try to be happy when she showed them the last small pyjamas she had bought for the baby.

A few years ago, a woman I know had the same kind of pregnancy with "anencefalia". There was no possibility to live for the baby. Doctors induced the abort and nobody had to suffer as the first woman did, although this mother also suffered when she received the notice, of course, and her decision was difficult but needed.

I've known a few cases plus with malformation in fetus and women have always decided to abort. In all the cases I know I've been witness of the suffering of these women for having the decision, but what to do in front of a unviable fetus?

But I've know women who have aborted (contraceptives are not 100% effective) because their circumstances weren't good enough to have a child at that moment, because they were too young or they had family or economic problems.

Personally, I can say that I wouldn't make a decision like that (except an unviable fetus), and I would never advise any woman to abort, either, but I like the existence of this kind of freedom for a woman.

[Chris]

Originally Posted by Jessica

it's the woman's choice 100% because it's her body

What if the baby is a girl? Then by your "it's the woman's body" you'd have to wait and ask the baby.

Escucharme. It is NOT just a clump of cells. It IS a baby. Abortion IS murder. Rape is not a reason to abort, it's a reason to give a child a chance with his or her adoptive parents. The only reason I'll give you for it is that if both the mother and the baby are going to die and taking one to save the other will work then I think it is okay.

Use protection. If you use the pill and he wears a condom then two 99.99% chance of pregnancy and we are not having this conversation.

Stop murdering babies!

[CrOtALiTo]

Originally Posted by Jessica

well maybe you're right but as I said before, it's the woman's choice 100% because it's her body...maybe it's better for her to have it and give it up for adoption...but she should not be forced that. If she wants the abortion, let her have it.

also, I'm not saying all pro-life people do it, but remember when that abortion doctor was killed? The person that killed him was a hypocrite. He's against a murder of a baby and he kills someone....again, not all pro-life people are like that. I'm just saying that no one has the right to decide what a woman should do with her own body :S that's all

Maybe the woman should have been more responsible...but ultimately, it's still her choice...

Jessica.

I understand your choice and your election.
Although I'm not agree with your think way, but well I tend to respect your own opinion, here everyone have a different and quite opinion about the thread, you know your question is very controversial and you will find a lot of answer and opinions about it.

[irmamar]

What do you think if the rapist is her father, brother or uncle? (I do not invent).

In front of a rape, everything that helps the woman to get over the trauma is acceptable, in my opinion. The worse thing that could happen to a woman is being raped. I'm not sure if men understand it.

[JPablo]

I think that men and women can understand that. The origin of the problem is at the root of "education" or call it "civilization".

True, I may be "playing" with a lot of "if" and conditionals... but the solution to such a problem would be handled by "attacking" the irrationality that causes a father, a brother or an uncle to do such irrational and criminal act.

By the same token, "capital punishment" would be "acceptable"... if we "justify" killing.

We are talking about "euthanasia" and we are talking about a subject that is very broad and complex. Which has to do with Ethics and Morals.

If everybody followed the old golden rule of "try not to do to others what you don't want done to you" or the positive side of it "try to do to others what you wanted others to do to you..."

If everybody could follow just that... if everybody could trust each other...

If...

[irmamar]

Among those "if" you could add that if abortion is forbidden, many women will go to backstree abortion, which I think is much worse. I agree that this is a "tema peliagudo", but I defend the women to have the possibility to decide without breaking the law. There are many situations where a woman can be which may drive her to take this decision, and I don't think a woman practise such thing as a sport, but because of circumstances and with great problems in her mind. Then, if you don't agree with them, you can say: "Allá cada uno con su conciencia".

[Perikles]

Originally Posted by Chris

Rape is not a reason to abort

This is judgmental, simplistic and dogmatic. What on earth gives men the right to pass moral judgment on how a woman reacts to being raped?

[poli]

Chis, if you were adopting would you feel comfortable about adopting the
product of a brutal rape. It isn't the newborn's fault but wouldn't you have it in the back of your head that it inherited it father's dreadful
traits? Would you adopt one? I wouldn't. In a case the this, if I were the rape victim's friend, spouse or family member, I would not discourage aborting the fetus.

If it were the job of men to put up with a a nine-month pregnancy, few men would put up with an unwanted pregnancy. Why should women?

[CrOtALiTo]

Irmamar.

I go it your commentary. But even so I don't believe necessary to kill a life more, I know if the women are crossing of a great trauma, but they don't implicate to have that kill other life much less if the kid doesn't has fault in the facts.

I believe this thread never will end and definitely, there're diversity to opinions around this thread already this thread is very controversial way.

No ones have forbidding you or some women to make her a abort, not that is not the idea, but my idea is keep the life although that life means the more pain of the world.

That is my humble point, I don't discriminate any last commentary.

[Jessica]

it's pretty simple. No one should tell a woman what to do. She makes the final decision. I read somewhere about a girl who was nine and her mother and the doctors were excommunicated or something because she had an abortion. she was only 9, why should she have those twins? all life is sacred...well you don't care about the girl? and the church didn't even do it to the step father that raped her

[wafflestomp]

Wow, I seem to have missed this thread.

Let me start by saying one thing, as Jessica has said, it is the woman's body. It is not your call what she can do with it. I see the point Chris, and a few other members have, that if she made the mistake to have an unwanted pregnancy, she should 'just deal', well, let's debunk that. Do you really want a woman to be essentially punished in the form of childbirth for not using protection or for not being ready for sex? Do you want that baby to be born into a household it's not wanted in? Do you want it to be born to a 20 year old girl who can't provide for it? You might think, oh, have it adopted. Wrong. Adoption is not the solution to everything. Adoption is a painfully grueling process for the mother, and for the child, for that matter. I have a friend who was adopted, and she got pregnant at a young age, and she is refusing to put it up for adoption like her parents want because she will not let it go through what she had to go through. The fact that your parents, are not really your parents. The fact that the people you live with aren't even related to you. The fact that your biological parents did not want you (even if that isn't the case, that's how it feels). It's just not right. Plus, adoption involves a lot of negatives. Look at the people who do it just for money, and can give a flying crap about the child they adopt. You really need to think of this as more than a "oh well she deserves it" thing. As for the only in cases of rape thing, that side is not feasible. Realize this. Court cases take up to or over a year. A pregnancy is 9 months. Women usually find out within a couple of weeks. Many rape victims do not report their rapes, and on top of that, where's the accountability here? What if the police botch the evidence and the rape case goes down the toilet, but she's still pregnant. What happens then? Who decides? What if we make it illegal, and women start faking rape on any random person in order to get an abortion. And don't even get me started on back-alley coat hanger abortions if it were made illegal.

[CrOtALiTo]

In some many parts about your commentary I'm quite agree with you, but I don't believe necessary abort any baby for the only reason that the women never used an contraceptive mean she was sex with some man, not I don't think so, the baby hasn't fault in this live and he or she has the fault, you think this.

Do you like have been aborted for your mother?

Not I don't believe did you like that, neither to me, therefore, I'm going for the life and don't for the abort, now just you have said about if it's just or not just an adoption, yes I believe that is an alternative for the many families who can't have kids in nature way, because you know it, there're much illness that can impossibility to has children, then the adoption is an alternative therefore for a lot of couples in the world, I prefer to have children with an adoptive family than in the street drinking themselves or ingesting themselves drugs, in the street really they endure more than with a adoptive family.

That was my view point.

My commentary wasn't with any desire to offend to anyone plus for the people who are agree with the abortion.

[Esperar]

My stance is, if the woman wants the child out, fine. Let her get her stomach cut open, and take the baby out that way, fully intact so it at least has a chance to survive. Don't try and tell me it's OK to crush the baby's head in order to get it out though.

(I prefer pro choice people not to reproduce, and raise children)

[CrOtALiTo]

Originally Posted by Esperar

My stance is, if the woman wants the child out, fine. Let her get her stomach cut open, and take the baby out that way, fully intact so it at least has a chance to survive. Don't try and tell me it's OK to crush the baby's head in order to get it out though.

(I prefer pro choice people not to reproduce, and raise children)

I'm sorry, but I don't agree with you completely.


Quite I'm with the life and the opportunity to life someday, you and me we are here in this world thanks to our parents, I don't know if you life was said or happy, but always the life is the best first gave for the human and god, then nothing absolute no ones has the right to quit or kill to any inoffensive baby and a new life for this planet.

I'm again, my intention never was discriminate to anyone and much less offending you, only I'm favour of the life.

[dodgingflames]

I'm pro-life, but not anti-abortion. I don't think you should kill unborn children, but I also know no matter what, people will, and I'd rather someone qualified did it than someone with a coat hanger.

[CrOtALiTo]

I'm sorry for ask you this, but I have the doubt and I can't understand quite your post.

What is a coat harder?

Yeah I'm agree with you completely, because no ones have the right to kill to under born in this life, no ones have the right to decide who lives or who not lives, not completely the people who kills to innocents babies in this live, definitely they will pay in front god someday, that I quite sure, because all you do in this life is paid later when you are front to god.

Not please you don't continue killing to children, because if you don't want children then you should to care you when you have sexual relation, please you care you, besides you protecting you over any contagious illness also you care to other people and you haven't children don't wished to this sick and dire planet full of sick people.

I'm sorry for say sick people but I can contain this hate for the people who are kill today and the next day more innocent children.

I'm sorry for my letter.

Sincerely yours.

[Jessica]

Originally Posted by dodgingflames

I'm pro-life, but not anti-abortion. I don't think you should kill unborn children, but I also know no matter what, people will, and I'd rather someone qualified did it than someone with a coat hanger.

I don't like unborn children getting killed either but nevertheless it's still the woman's choice. it's her body...

[Elaina]

Originally Posted by Jessica

I don't like unborn children getting killed either but nevertheless it's still the woman's choice. it's her body...

Then use it responsibly.

Listen, if you know your body can give life to another human being and you know that by having unprotected sex can get you pregnant, then be responsible and if you don't want children you have only one option.
#1.........DON'T HAVE SEX

Don't trust that your partner is protecting you. PROTECT YOURSELF.

It's as simple as that!