Subjunctive exercise 5-5

[laepelba]

I have questions about two sentences in the exercise that I just completed. This was a translating exercise (English to Spanish). Only ONE is an actual question about the subjunctive.

1) Given English: The team will go to bed early so that they can play better tomorrow.
The book's translation to Spanish: El equipo se acostará temprano para poder jugar mejor mañana.
My question: Why isn't it "para que puedan...."?

10) Given English: He and I are going to play chess, although he usually wins.
The book's translation to Spanish: Él y yo vamos a jugar al ajedrez, aunque gerenalmente él gana.
My question: Why isn't "ganar" used in the subjunctive here? I thought it should have been "gane"......

Thanks for any suggestions you can give me!

[AngelicaDeAlquezar]

1) Remember the thing about same subject -> infinitive, different subject -> subjunctive?
El equipo se acostará temprano para poder jugar. -> same subject.
El equipo se acostará temprano para que el capitán pueda jugar mejor. -> different subject.


10) Which necessary condition for subjunctive do you find there?


*Btw, "generalmente".

[wrholt]

Originally Posted by laepelba

I have questions about two sentences in the exercise that I just completed. This was a translating exercise (English to Spanish). Only ONE is an actual question about the subjunctive.

1) Given English: The team will go to bed early so that they can play better tomorrow.
The book's translation to Spanish: El equipo se acostará temprano para poder jugar mejor mañana.
My question: Why isn't it "para que puedan...."?

10) Given English: He and I are going to play chess, although he usually wins.
The book's translation to Spanish: Él y yo vamos a jugar al ajedrez, aunque gerenalmente él gana.
My question: Why isn't "ganar" used in the subjunctive here? I thought it should have been "gane"......

Thanks for any suggestions you can give me!

We'll see what our native speakers have to say, but here's my two cents:
1. In this context, "para que puedan" may suggest that the "they" who will play better is different than "el equipo". "Para poder" eliminates the ambiguity.

10. "Although usually he wins" is a report of past events as a statement of facts.

[chileno]

Originally Posted by AngelicaDeAlquezar

1) Remember the thing about same subject -> infinitive, different subject -> subjunctive?
El equipo se acostará temprano para poder jugar. -> same subject.
El equipo se acostará temprano para que el capitán pueda jugar mejor. -> different subject.

Originally Posted by wrholt

We'll see what our native speakers have to say, but here's my two cents:
1. In this context, "para que puedan" may suggest that the "they" who will play better is different than "el equipo". "Para poder" eliminates the ambiguity.

I have a problem with that.

El equipo se acostará temprano para que el capitán pueda jugar mejor. ¿Quién dice que el capitán se acostará a la misma hora que el resto del equipo, aunque sea del mismo equipo?

It isn't that the "they" might be different subject, but there is a doubt as to their performance.... (iffy)

That's how I understand it.

El equipo de acostará más temprano para poder jugar mejor - it's making a statement of being certain their resting well will influence their performance favorably.

But "el equipo se acostará temprano para que pueda jugar mejor" states there are doubts they might perform better even if they rest well.

[laepelba]

Thanks, all, for your help. Here was my original thinking:

1) This chapter in the book (the use of the subjunctive in adverbial phrases) used all expressions that contain "que". "Para que" was on their list of expressions that are *sometimes* followed by the subjunctive, depending on the factor of anticipation.

Therefore, I used the phrase "para que" ... there were absolutely NO examples that did not have the word "que". And I thought that when used at the beginning of an adverbial clause, "que" must be followed by a conjugated verb, right? And "para que" is always followed by the subjunctive.

So, again, I thought that the book had valid examples that supported the material in the chapter. Again, I was wrong.....

10) Doh! Spelling! Thanks, Malila ... generalmente!!

In this one, "aunque generalmente él [ganar]" is an adverbial phrase (topic of the chapter) with "aunque" (according to the chapter, "aunque" sometimes is and sometimes is not followed by the subjunctive, depending on the anticipation....). So, to answer your question, Malila, I guess that the condition I was looking at was the adverbial phrase in a situation that does or does not always actually happen. (Just like when "cuando" is sometimes followed by the subjunctive.) I guess I was looking at the fact that the winning doesn't always happen.....

But I understand your explanations of this one. Thanks!!

[aleCcowaN]

1) As already explained. The captain is part of the team, so any speculation is immaterial. Besides, using "para que pueda jugar" provokes immediately a "who?" in the mind of who's hearing this -no matter it is correct- as if the person got distracted a tenth of a second and lost some information.

10) Known piece of information vs. new piece of information:

... aunque generalmente gana (entérate)
... aunque generalmente gane (como ya sabes)

And adverb like "generalmente" might suggest new information because we are pretty precise presenting a new piece of information and sloppier while referring well known information.