[Other] El noruego es el idioma más fácil de aprender

[Tomisimo]

Me tropecé con un interesantísimo artículo que da bases lingüísticas para creer que para los angloparlantes el idioma más fácil de aprender es el noruego. En el artículo, el autor habla del noruego, el sueco, el holandés, y el afrikáans, comparándolos en cuanto a la facilidad de adquirir para uno que habla inglés. El noruego, al igual que el holandés el un idioma germánico, y eso nos da una ventaja, pues el inglés también lo es. En fin, si te gusta la lingüística y los idiomas, disfrutarás este artículo.

[ElDanés]

¡Gracias para el artículo, Tomisimo!

La gramática del "bokmål" es casi misma gramática del danés, porque "bokmål" era una adaptación del viejo escrito danés. Yo supongo danés sería más fácil "bokmål" si no fuera por la pronunciación.

We mumble too much in Danish.

(It took quite some time, and Wiktionary to write the Spanish text, but everybody has to start somewhere.)

[Rusty]

Originally Posted by ElDanés

¡Gracias por el artículo, Tomísimo!

La gramática del "bokmål" es casi la misma que la (la gramática) del danés, porque "bokmål" era una adaptación del viejo escrito danés. Yo supongo que el danés sería más fácil (para aprender) que el "bokmål" si no fuera por la pronunciación.

We mumble too much in Danish.

(It took quite some time, and Wiktionary to write the Spanish text, but everybody has to start somewhere.)

You did a pretty great job for your first attempt at Spanish! I've made some small corrections for you.

I also liked the article, David. Thanks for sharing.

I wasn't aware that the Danes mumbled a lot.

[ElDanés]

¡Gracias, Rusty, por las correcciones!

Algunas preguntas...

Originally Posted by Rusty

¡Gracias por el artículo, [...]

The por/para-problem seems to trouble all beginners. Fortunately, I found a website, which I believe does a good job explaining the usage.
I'll read up on it, when I get some time on my hands.

Originally Posted by Rusty

[...] misma que la [...] supongo que el danés [...] que el "bokmål"

Apparently que can be used in lots of ways, including that, than, because, etc. I'm sure I will learn the correct usage through time, and fortunately will the context help me on the way, when I'm reading a text.

Originally Posted by Rusty

[...] la (la gramática) del danés [...]

So, you don't actually need the noun? Is it just okay to use the article only (la, el, and what about lo)?

Originally Posted by Rusty

[...] (para aprender) [...]

Why do we need para here?

[Rusty]

Originally Posted by ElDanés

¡Gracias, Rusty, por las correcciones!

Algunas preguntas...

The por/para-problem seems to trouble all beginners. Fortunately, I found a website, which I believe does a good job explaining the usage.
I'll read up on it, when I get some time on my hands. There are many places that try to teach the difference. Each is similar, however, so I won't bother posting them here.

Apparently que can be used in lots of ways, including that, than, becauseporque, etc. I'm sure I will learn the correct usage through time, and fortunately will the context help me on the way, when I'm reading a text.

So, you don't actually need the noun? Is it just okay to use the article only (la, el, and what about lo)? The word la, as used here, is a relative pronoun. In English, we would say 'as that' instead of 'que la'.

Why do we need para here? It introduces the infinitive that follows, because it cannot stand alone. In English, this is not a requirement.

Good questions. If my answers need more explaining, please ask.

[ElDanés]

I don't know all those fancy terms yet. I'm pretty new to languages like I also stated in my introductions-thread, so I will have to learn more about general grammar and terminology. I have my whole weekend off, so I've plenty of room to study in, but for now, I think I understood your explanations pretty well, although my lack of knowledge of grammar terminology, so ¡gracias otra vez!

Originally Posted by Rusty

I found it here, but now when I read more carefully, I see that it is not exactly a "right" because.

[Rusty]

I'm not exactly sure myself that it is a relative pronoun, and should probably retract that part of the statement. However, it is a pronoun (it takes the place of a noun), and it's OK to leave out the noun (and its article) if a pronoun takes its place.

The multiple uses of que is also a sore spot for beginners. Thanks for the link that shows when que can mean because, because I couldn't remember.

[ElDanés]

Originally Posted by Rusty

However, it is a pronoun (it takes the place of a noun), and it's OK to leave out the noun (and its article) if a pronoun takes its place.

So shall one use el instead of la, when it's a masculine noun, and not a feminine noun?

Like:
Gracias por el artículo. (Thank you for the article.)
Gracias por el. (Thank you for it.)

Gracias por la corrección. (Thank you for the correction.)
Gracias por la. (Thank you for it.)

[Tomisimo]

Originally Posted by ElDanés

So shall one use el instead of la, when it's a masculine noun, and not a feminine noun?

Like:
Gracias por el artículo. (Thank you for the article.)
Gracias por el. (Thank you for it.)

Gracias por la corrección. (Thank you for the correction.)
Gracias por la. (Thank you for it.)

Some examples will help:

Gracias por el artículo.
Gracias por él.

Gracias por el artículo que mi diste.
Gracias por el que me diste.

Gracias por la corrección.
Gracias por ella.

Gracias por la corrección que me diste.
Gracias por la que me diste.

[Rusty]

Originally Posted by ElDanés

So shall one use el instead of la, when it's a masculine noun, and not a feminine noun? Yes, in the case above, you can use el when the noun it's replacing is masculine. In either case, the combination of que la or que el will translate to 'as/than that'.

Like:
Gracias por el artículo. (Thank you for the article.)
Gracias por el. (Thank you for it.)

Gracias por la corrección. (Thank you for the correction.)
Gracias por la. (Thank you for it.)

The last two sentences should be gracias por él or gracias por ella. Here, we're dealing with another part of speech - a prepositional phrase. The preposition is por and its object is el artículo or la corrección. If we want to use a pronoun for the object of a preposition, it must be either él or ella.

Pronoun usage will be a fun adventure. It would take me a long time to explain it all at once. Let's tackle each case as we come to it.

[ElDanés]

Thanks to you both.

Spanish is not the hardest language to learn, but it's hard enough.
And yes, it sounds like a good idea to take it in small steps, like you said Rusty.

[CrOtALiTo]

El Danés good night.

The Spanish ain't hard to learn, look, it's well known in all the world is more the Spanish has a lot of words and all type than English hasn't it, if you want learn faster the Spanish you must enter to website where there're chats rooms and you must meet people in the same chat room people Spanish speakers, in the same talk with the people you going a lil to a lil and you'll see that your Spanish go to get better through of the time, I told you before, you need chat with some one and you practice your Spanish it's necessary, the Spanish has more words than the English but together the language when the person doesn't meet them, it became harder in learn, but if you practice with the speakers natives people it'll became easier.


Regards.


Anyway nowadays the English is the first language in the world.

[ElDanés]

Actually, it's morning where I am, but whatever.

You are right about that using the language helps one learn it faster, but I don't think I need a chat for now, I think this forum is fine for my current needs. I don't participate in the Spanish discussions at the moment, but I try to follow them the best I can.

[Rusty]

Crotalito,

I disagree that Spanish has more words than English. Spanish has about half the words that English has. Don't infer by this statement that I think Spanish is inferior to English in any way. It just has fewer words.
This is because English vocabulary principally comes from two sources, whereas Spanish vocabulary comes principally from one source. Both English and Spanish contain words derived from Latin, but English also has Germanic words that carry the exact same meaning.

Here are just a few examples:
(Germanic / Latin)

anger / rage
ask / inquire
aware / cognizant
before / prior, anti-
begin / commence
belief / creed
bird (adj) / aviary
brave / audacious
brotherly, motherly, fatherly / fraternal, maternal, paternal
building / edifice
cat, dog, cow, wolf (adj) / feline, canine, bovine, lupine
child / infant
cold / frigid
deadly / mortal
delay / moratorium
eye / ocular
follow / ensue
first / primary
forbid / prohibit
freedom / liberty
friendly / amicable
gather / assemble
gift / present
give / provide
god / deity
guess / estimate
harbor / port
hate / detest
height, length, width / altitude, longitude, latitude
help / assist
hill / mount
house / domicile
land / terrain
late / tardy
meet / encounter
mistake / error
moon (adj) / lunar
need / require
other / alien
road / street
rot / putrify
sea (adj) / marine
see / perceive
seem / appear
shape / form
shy / timid
sight / vision
sleeping / dormant
son (adj) / filial
sorrow / grief
strength / fortitude
sun (adj) / solar
thinking / pensive
thought / idea
tongue / language
tree (adj) / arbor
truth / veracity
understand / comprehend
watch / observe
watchful / vigilant
western / occidental
whole / entire
wife / spouse
wild / savage
wise / prudent
wish / desire
womanly, manly / feminine, masculine
wood / forest
worldly / mundane
wrath / ire
youthful / juvenile
yearly / annual
water (adj) / aquatic

[CrOtALiTo]

Rusty I disagree with you because the Spanish has more words than English now, Do you know it.?, In English the words are very exact, you always need specify all in the English if you don't to do it, never you won't understand the phrase, and Spanish ain't so, in Spanish you can speak with some one of a form more free without that need you find the word exact or understanding about, I think what the Spanish is easier learn, it's faster than English, it's less complicated, the Speakers Spanish has more word than Speakers Mexican or another country here in American Latina, please you must find in the internet, if the English has more words than Spanish or less than the Spanish whatever we are both know what the languages are understanding with very few words.

Regards.

[Tomisimo]

En cuanto a la facilidad de aprender, el español tiene la ventaja de su ortografía y fontética regulares, y por otro lado, el inglés tiene la ventaja de conjugaciones e inflecciones muy sencillas y regulares. Para uno de habla española que aprende el inglés, la mayor dificultad son los sonidos, sobre todo los de las vocales, que no existen en el español.

[CrOtALiTo]

Yeah, I'm agree with you.

[María José]

Originally Posted by Rusty

You did a pretty great job for your first attempt at Spanish! I've made some small corrections for you.

I also liked the article, David. Thanks for sharing.

I wasn't aware that the Danes mumbled a lot.

I'm sure you thought it was just English-speaking people that mumbled... Listening Comprehension exercises are always the most difficult for my students, and they always complain about the way the people on the CD, DVD and even me pronounce things.
German is a lot more difficult for me and if I watch a film I'll probably not understand what they are talking about most of the time but I'm able to isolate the words I know and could even write them down.
That's languages for you, anyway. Each one has it's little quirks and that's what makes them interesting.

[Rusty]

Originally Posted by CrOtALiTo

Rusty I disagree with you because the Spanish has more words than English now, Do you know it.?, In English the words are very exact, you always need specify all in the English if you don't to do it, never you won't understand the phrase, and Spanish ain't so, in Spanish you can speak with some one of a form more free without that need you find the word exact or understanding about, I think what the Spanish is easier learn, it's faster than English, it's less complicated, the Speakers Spanish has more word than Speakers Mexican or another country here in American Latina, please you must find in the internet, if the English has more words than Spanish or less than the Spanish whatever we are both know what the languages are understanding with very few words.

Regards.

Perhaps I've misunderstood what you were trying to explain. It's hard to understand what you've written, in both posts.

I based my statements on Internet findings, but they were also based on my idea of what you were trying to say. I searched for the language that has the largest vocabulary. According to numerous scholars, English has the largest vocabulary. The next largest in size is German, followed by Russian. Spanish and French tie for fourth place.

[Tomisimo]

Originally Posted by CrOtALiTo

Yeah, I'm agree with you.

Debes decir: Yes, I agree with you.

Originally Posted by Rusty

Perhaps I've misunderstood what you were trying to explain. It's hard to understand what you've written, in both posts.

I based my statements on Internet findings, but they were also based on my idea of what you were trying to say. I searched for the language that has the largest vocabulary. According to numerous scholars, English has the largest vocabulary. The next largest in size is German, followed by Russian. Spanish and French tie for fourth place.

It depends on what you count as a word, and many other factors. But it is generally accepted that English has more words than any other human language.