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  #21
Old May 06, 2009, 02:27 PM
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Seguro que sí, Fazor.
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  #22
Old May 06, 2009, 02:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by poli View Post
Creo que en unos paises nórdicos como Holanda no tienen esa arrogancia. Hay otros paises tambien. Conozco un uzbekistani que habla ruso, uzbek, inglés, turko, hebreo y es un barbero. Aquí si un anglo como yo habla un otro idioma es hito grande, pero en otras culturas no es nada especial.
There should be a country for foreigners... (maybe USA )

jajaja

Puede que pase. No dudo que hay de todo en todas partes.

El punto era, que no solamente pasa en USA.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AngelicaDeAlquezar View Post
My point was = Lo que quería decir era que... / La idea era que...
What I wanted to say was.../ The idea was...

Correcto.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AngelicaDeAlquezar View Post
"El punto era" can be said, but I guess only in Mexico, where English expressions are literally transported to Spanish and widely used like that.

Ok. Me van a decir uds dos, Angelica e irmamar, ¿que no se utiliza en español, la frase/muletilla o lo que sea que esta en rojo alla arriba?



Y..

Sí Fazor, es muy importante no dejar de aprender.

Otra cosa que creo pasa en todas partes, es que cualquier extranjero aprende, o trata de aprender el idioma que esta adoptando, bien. Y algunas personas del pais les importa un pepino el esfuerzo que hace esa persona. Total, es esa persona la que quiere vivir aqui...

Eso lo he escuchado de chilenos, argentinos etc... :-)

Last edited by chileno; May 06, 2009 at 02:51 PM.
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  #23
Old May 06, 2009, 03:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irmamar View Post
I don't think that it depends on the countries, but on the person(-or individual). I meet German people who speak several languages. But there are places here in Spain "occupied" by Germans (or English), and everything is written in German in those places(like in Spain there are towns in Mexico where English is the language), you go there and you don't understand anything, and they don't speak Spanish at all. Such things shouldn't be allowed, I think,
Creo que si es un pais donde la cultura es dominante en el mundo como
España, EE.UU, UK la gente siente menos deseo aprender otros idiomas.Por ejemplo todos los españoles hablan castellano, pero sé que todos los españoles no hablan catalán o gallego. La razón es que castellano es dominante. Aquí(EE.UU.) vivimos en un pais de imigrantes, pero casi los únicos que hablan otro idioma son imigrantes de la primera generación (los recien llegados) y segunda generación(sus hijos). Los nietos en general hablan inglés y unas pocas palabras de la lengua de sus abuelos porque inglés es dominante.
En el Canadá, la provincia de Quebec es francófono, pero la mayoria de gente hablan ingés tambien. En Ontario, una provincia anglo, casi no se oye francés.
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  #24
Old May 06, 2009, 03:21 PM
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@Hernán: "El punto" used as "the idea" is to me an Anglicism, but maybe it's just my own prejudice.
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  #25
Old May 06, 2009, 05:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AngelicaDeAlquezar View Post
@Hernán: "El punto" used as "the idea" is to me an Anglicism, but maybe it's just my own prejudice.
I think it is your own prejudice, because I grew up listening to that.

Now, I imagine that it is used in Spain too. I know Peruvians use it also. Not here in the US, but there. You know there, right?
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  #26
Old May 06, 2009, 06:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irmamar View Post
Yes, I suppose, you're always asking strange things

Huh? I am? Like what?
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  #27
Old May 06, 2009, 06:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fazor View Post
I think I figured out why I like this forum so much. It's the same reason why I like the science/astronomy forum I frequent. Both places attract people who are inquisitive and have a desire to learn.

In person, when many of my friends hear I'm trying to better my Spanish, I kind of get these "Why in the world would you do that?!" looks. I'm the kind of person who just loves to learn; I don't need a reason. And, it seems, the other users here are the same way.

I mean, I figure it's never bad to learn something new, right? Anyway, just a random thought before I head off to a work meeting. I'll try to post this again in Spanish when I have the time to do so.
I think that you are in the website because you like the form in that you learn your Spanish besides, the people who are inside of the website are very nice, therefore you entered to the website because, you felt the need to learn your language prefer, as my case, I found this website thought of a girl who was my friend time before, and well I liked the website since the first moment that I saw the post and the people as helped you in all the time.


I didn't see any other website where the people helping you more than here.
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  #28
Old May 06, 2009, 08:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrOtALiTo View Post
I think that you are in the website because you like the form in that you learn your Spanish besides, the people who are inside of the website are very nice, therefore you entered to the website because, you felt the need to learn your language prefer, as my case, I found this website thought of a girl who was my friend time before, and well I liked the website since the first moment that I saw the post and the people as helped you in all the time.


I didn't see any other website where the people helping you more than here.
I agree! I was telling my husband the other day how helpful and nice and respectful people on this site are. I've looked around at a few language sites and it's almost like the people who are fluent in the language you are trying to learn are bothered by the fact that you even exist with all your ignorance of the language . It's this weird almost holier than thou thing .
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  #29
Old May 07, 2009, 03:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chileno View Post
There should be a country for foreigners... (maybe USA )

jajaja

Puede que pase. No dudo que hay de todo en todas partes.

El punto era, que no solamente pasa en USA.



What I wanted to say was.../ The idea was...

Correcto.




Ok. Me van a decir uds dos, Angelica e irmamar, ¿que no se utiliza en español, la frase/muletilla o lo que sea que esta en rojo alla arriba?



Y..

Sí Fazor, es muy importante no dejar de aprender.

Otra cosa que creo pasa en todas partes, es que cualquier extranjero aprende, o trata de aprender el idioma que esta adoptando, bien. Y algunas personas del pais les importa un pepino el esfuerzo que hace esa persona. Total, es esa persona la que quiere vivir aqui...

Eso lo he escuchado de chilenos, argentinos etc... :-)
En España no decimos "el punto" en este sentido. Usamos "el tema" o "la cuestión":

La cuestión/el tema es que nos dejen hablar en la reunión.


Quote:
Originally Posted by poli View Post
Creo que si es un pais donde la cultura es dominante en el mundo como
España, EE.UU, UK la gente siente menos deseo aprender otros idiomas.Por ejemplo todos los españoles hablan castellano, pero sé que todos los españoles no hablan catalán o gallego. La razón es que castellano es dominante. Aquí(EE.UU.) vivimos en un pais de imigrantes, pero casi los únicos que hablan otro idioma son imigrantes de la primera generación (los recien llegados) y segunda generación(sus hijos). Los nietos en general hablan inglés y unas pocas palabras de la lengua de sus abuelos porque inglés es dominante.
En el Canadá, la provincia de Quebec es francófono, pero la mayoria de gente hablan ingés tambien. En Ontario, una provincia anglo, casi no se oye francés.
En España se habla castellano y multitud de idiomas oficiales o no. Sólo se hablan los idiomas cooficiales en las zonas donde realmente están reconocidos. Te diré los idiomas que se hablan: castellano, catalán, gallego, euskera, bable o asturleonés, aranés, aragonés con sus múltiples variedades y el tamazight (en Melilla) además de una variante árabe en Ceuta que no recuerdo, sin olvidar el portugués y el francés en sus áreas de influencia. Creo que no me dejo ninguno... Después están todos los dialectos y mezclas de dos idiomas en áreas de influencia. ¡Casi nada! Es casi una misión imposible hablar todas las lenguas de este país, puedes entender más o menos algo o nada, pero normalmente prefieres dedicar tu tiempo a estudiar lenguas más mayoritarias.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jchen View Post
Huh? I am? Like what?
Cariotipos, ADN, bichos de varios colores y no sé cuántas alas... Aren't they strange things?



Quote:
Originally Posted by AutumnBreeze View Post
I agree! I was telling my husband the other day how helpful and nice and respectful people on this site are. I've looked around at a few language sites and it's almost like the people who are fluent in the language you are trying to learn are bothered by the fact that you even exist with all your ignorance of the language . It's this weird almost holier than thou thing .
I agree with you, people here are very helpful and respecful. I like this site, too.
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  #30
Old May 07, 2009, 04:34 AM
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El hecho de que un idioma domine creo que es históricamente por cuestiones mercantiles y poder. Quizás algún día nos veremos forzados a aprender el chino. Pero de momento, domina el inglés en el mundo por el poder mercantil de EE.UU. El español que se habla en los países colindantes se ve afectado por la necesidad de la gente de ganarse el pan de cada día que migran a EE.UU. o tienen negocios, televisión y demás, ligados a ese país. De ahí tanto Spanglish o palabras derivadas del inglés en México y en menos medida en otros países del continente americano de habla hispana. Los canadienses han tenido que legislar para proteger el francés, como en España se ha hecho con los idiomas hablados en Cataluña, Galicia, País Vasco, etc.
En la India, el idioma oficial es el inglés por cuestiones prácticas ya que es el país donde más idiomas y dialectos existen y, volviendo al tema del poder, utilizan el idioma del país que los “conquistó”, como pienso que pasó en los países de Sudamérica y Centroamérica.
Pero la gente monolingüe es minoritaria en este mundo. En cuestión de número, la mayoría de la población mundial habla más de un idioma. Solo hay que imaginarse cuanta gente vive en China, Rusia y los países colindantes, la India, los países africanos, los países de Sudamérica (si me olvido de alguno, que me perdonen) y cuantos idiomas y dialectos se hablan en esos países aparte del idioma oficial.
Realmente creo que los que vivimos en zonas monolingües, estamos en desventaja.
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  #31
Old May 07, 2009, 08:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AutumnBreeze View Post
I agree! I was telling my husband the other day how helpful and nice and respectful people on this site are. I've looked around at a few language sites and it's almost like the people who are fluent in the language you are trying to learn are bothered by the fact that you even exist with all your ignorance of the language . It's this weird almost holier than thou thing .
And most likely is from your own people that speak Spanish, right?

It happens in other forums dedicated to teaching english, too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by irmamar View Post
En España no decimos "el punto" en este sentido. Usamos "el tema" o "la cuestión":

La cuestión/el tema es que nos dejen hablar en la reunión.
Correcto también. En Chile se ocupa(ba) de las tres maneras.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ambarina View Post
Realmente creo que los que vivimos en zonas monolingües, estamos en desventaja.
Tienes toda la razón Ambarina, en cuanto a lo del poder economico imperante, en algun momento de la historia.

Solo que lo que dijiste al final, me pareció gracioso e incongruente.

Me imagino que la gente que vive colindante al limite de Portugal, hablan mezcla de ambos idiomas, ¿no? Lo mismo debe pasar para la zona limitrofe con Francia y con Marruecos.

Ni que decir, dentro de España misma, por ej: con la gente que vive cerca de la vascongada. etc...


Lo que pasa, es uno nunca mira muy hacia adentro y casi siempre se mira hacia afuera.
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  #32
Old May 07, 2009, 09:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chileno View Post

Tienes toda la razón Ambarina, en cuanto a lo del poder economico imperante, en algun momento de la historia.

Solo que lo que dijiste al final, me pareció gracioso e incongruente.

Me imagino que la gente que vive colindante al limite de Portugal, hablan mezcla de ambos idiomas, ¿no? Cierto. El Gallego se parece de algún modo al Portugués. Lo mismo debe pasar para la zona limitrofe con Francia (Catalán) y con Marruecos (tamazight ).

Ni que decir, dentro de España misma, por ej: con la gente que vive cerca de la vascongada. etc...
Pero la excepción confirma la regla, ¿no? Vivo en una zona monolingüe colindante con otras dos zonas con sus idiomas respectivos y te puedo asegurar que aquí se habla castellano puro y duro.


Lo que pasa, es uno nunca mira muy hacia adentro y casi siempre se mira hacia afuera.
----------------------------
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  #33
Old May 07, 2009, 09:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AutumnBreeze View Post
I agree! I was telling my husband the other day how helpful and nice and respectful people on this site are. I've looked around at a few language sites and it's almost like the people who are fluent in the language you are trying to learn are bothered by the fact that you even exist with all your ignorance of the language . It's this weird almost holier than thou thing .
I didn't understand the part where you are saying ignorant. What did you mean with it. I hope it does not anything bad.


But as you have said, I'm trying to learn the best possible in this forums and anywhere.
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  #34
Old May 07, 2009, 09:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ambarina View Post
----------------------------

Ni que decir, dentro de España misma, por ej: con la gente que vive cerca de la vascongada. etc...
Pero la excepción confirma la regla, ¿no? Vivo en una zona monolingüe colindante con otras dos zonas con sus idiomas respectivos y te puedo asegurar que aquí se habla castellano puro y duro.

No me digas, Xica!

¿Se puede saber donde exactamente?
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  #35
Old May 07, 2009, 11:09 AM
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hmm me pregunto como seria un pais de extranjeros.....que tipo de gobierno habria?
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  #36
Old May 07, 2009, 11:30 AM
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hmm me pregunto como seria un pais de extranjeros.....que tipo de gobierno habria?
No creo, pero ellos necesitaría una bandera muy colorida!
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  #37
Old May 07, 2009, 12:01 PM
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Catalán is another Romance language, different from Castilian and French, this is not a mixture (I don't know if this is the correct word) of both languages. There are areas of influence from France and there people speak a mixture of both languages, and in the areas with Castilian influence, people speak another mixture quite different. But Catalonian is a completely different language, and the contact with France has not been so great in the history because of the Pirineos, except the place known as Valle de Arán, where another language is spoken: aranés. They're not dialects, they're authentic languages.
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  #38
Old May 07, 2009, 01:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Palomita blanca View Post
hmm me pregunto como seria un pais de extranjeros.....que tipo de gobierno habria?
Gobierno extranjero. ¿Que otro podría ser?

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  #39
Old May 07, 2009, 01:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irmamar View Post
Catalán is another Romance language, different from Castilian and French, this is not a mixture (I don't know if this is the correct word) of both languages. There are areas of influence from France and there people speak a mixture of both languages, and in the areas with Castilian influence, people speak another mixture quite different. But Catalonian is a completely different language, and the contact with France has not been so great in the history because of the Pirineos, except the place known as Valle de Arán, where another language is spoken: aranés. They're not dialects, they're authentic languages.
¡Qué interesante! Siempre pensaba que España tenía 4 idiomas. Ahora
sé que hay más. Seguro que es por las montañas. En el pasado habían
poblaciones aisladas por la cordillera y desarollaron sus propias lenguas.
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  #40
Old May 07, 2009, 08:43 PM
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Originally Posted by chileno View Post
And most likely is from your own people that speak Spanish, right?

It happens in other forums dedicated to teaching english, too.
chileno do you mean is this the attitude I have seen on other forums from native English speakers who are fluent in Spanish? Oh absolutely! I've also looked at Japanese and German learning sites, same thing. It's so odd!

Quote:
Originally Posted by CrOtALiTo View Post
I didn't understand the part where you are saying ignorant. What did you mean with it. I hope it does not anything bad.


But as you have said, I'm trying to learn the best possible in this forums and anywhere.
crotalito, 'ignorant' does not necessarily mean bad, just that one does not possess much knowledge about the subject at hand .
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